Image not available

1280x1758

IMG_6226.jpg

🧵 Question on Indians

Anonymous No. 16114056

Indians are usually high achievers in the west. They even produced brilliant mathematicians such as Srinivasa Ramanujan. Yet in India they seem no better than Africans. Is it that there’s over a billion so there’s bound to be some smart Indians, is it certain groups within India, or are Indians typically an intelligent people held back by cultural and economic factors?

Anonymous No. 16114099

Despite looking the same there are huge genetic differences between different castes. As is only expected Ramanujan belonged to the caste with more prestige.

Anonymous No. 16114102

Indians are high achievers in the west because our culture doesn't reward creativity and innovation anymore. Success means following a recipe, something Indians are very good at. Same with Chinese, no ability to work a problem that hasn't already been solved by a white person.

Anonymous No. 16114105

>>16114102
Please to advice on the needful sir *head bobble*

Image not available

1600x900

1761912-Brandon-M....jpg

Anonymous No. 16114115

>>16114102
>Success means following a recipe, something Indians are very good at. Same with Chinese, no ability to work a problem that hasn't already been solved by a white person.

Image not available

960x714

IMG_6228.jpg

Anonymous No. 16114125

>>16114115
are you the type of monkey that wouldn’t climb the ladder?

Anonymous No. 16114126

>>16114125
If you were as skilled as me it would be a yes. If it's true I can contact you, it's definite. Perhaps you don't have the foresight.

Anonymous No. 16114128

>>16114125
Putting crippled or lost parts into existence seems too hard or something. Not really.

Anonymous No. 16114134

>>16114126
>>16114128
perhaps one day i’ll understand whatever the fuck you’re saying

Anonymous No. 16114137

>>16114134
Fart for me baby girl. I said fart for me. Keep farting baby girl. -fart- -fart- -fart-

Anonymous No. 16114246

>>16114056
>Srinivasa Ramanujan
I hate, fucking HATE when geniuses and savants die young.

Von Neumann didn’t even live that long, FFS.

Ramanujan in particular probably would have looked like a cool, quirky old dude.

Imagine if Mozart lived until old age.

Anonymous No. 16114289

>>16114246
wait till you find out about alexander the great

Anonymous No. 16114378

>>16114246
>>16114289
Doesn’t it just piss you off?

Anonymous No. 16114392

>>16114289
You think the guy who believed himself to be a god and inherited a professional army from his dad which he led through the desert was a genius?

Anonymous No. 16114421

>>16114392
Yes, the guy who went 20-0 against the biggest and most powerful empire the world has seen up to that point while being outnumbered each battle, was indeed a genius. + Ruler worship was common in antiquity, he probably didn’t actually believe himself to a god, considering resentment from his troops upon adopting proskynesis caused him to stop the practice. Also the desert thing was a power move cause Cyrus lost his entire army traversing through it.

Image not available

1145x570

DariusL.png

Anonymous No. 16114437

>>16114421
>was a power move
Only lost 75 percent of his army wr any%, if I were in that army I'd be pissed and so would you.
The tactics were pretty dope, but you can't say he didn't actually believe himself to be a god. In the battle of Gaugamela that off angle cavalry charge was just an elaborate suicide attempt absolutely no regard for personal safety and he pulled that type of shit all the time.

Anonymous No. 16114463

>>16114437
He knew Darius would flee (as he did before) and Alexander’s highly skilled heavy cavalry definitely could’ve withstood Darius’ infantry guards, it wasn’t suicide it was a brave masterclass. To win in chess all you have to do is checkmate the king

Anonymous No. 16114495

>>16114115
India is a mistake.

Anonymous No. 16114547

>>16114056
why do people only mention ramanujan? its like india had 1 (one) genius and went back to drinking cow piss

Anonymous No. 16114556

>>16114547
there was never a pause in drinking cow piss

Anonymous No. 16114599

>>16114102
So why do Chinese have higher IQ’s than whites?

Anonymous No. 16114609

>>16114547
Chandrasekhar and Bose are known to /sci/

Anonymous No. 16114613

>>16114599
>something something whites have more soul
>something something whites have more inventions
>something something da joo's faked those IQ tests
>something something you're a shill

Anonymous No. 16114618

>>16114599
>why do the people standardized testing from 200 BC excels at standardizing testing
Is this one of them riddles?

Anonymous No. 16114640

>>16114618
So IQ is a meme then. Good to know.

Anonymous No. 16114668

>>16114618
What are you implying? That they study for their IQ tests lol?

Anonymous No. 16114672

>>16114668
The fact that you sound astounded by that is amusing. One of the more known beginner questions on an iq test is the Fibonacci sequence almost as if an iq test is a quiz of known patterns or something.

Anonymous No. 16114685

>>16114056
there are many subraces in India, and within those there are many castes

Anonymous No. 16114689

>>16114672
why don't you believe in asian genes coding for higher IQ?

Anonymous No. 16114699

>>16114689
Because I can explain the outcome without doing mental gymnastics. Show me poor Asians on the level of Ramanujan kicking ass and I'll change my mind. if it's genetic there should be a lot across the entire Asian spectrum not just the ranking/status obsessed Chinese/Korean/Japanese.

Anonymous No. 16114702

>>16114672
if the test has known patterns or words, it’s not a proper IQ test. Mensa doesn’t even include numbers in their tests

Anonymous No. 16114707

>>16114702
Are you telling me my performance if I go in blind will be the same if I do a number of practice runs and research on the org ahead of time?

Anonymous No. 16114737

>>16114707
No, but I don’t believe a notable amount of asians have practiced before being given the test.

Anonymous No. 16114799

>>16114056
Indians are mostly midwits (midwits here meaning 90 IQ) but India has a smart fraction which other large countries in Global south do not, which is why India routinely produces geniuses and is the only intelligent brown country today.

However I wouldn't say Indians are no better than Africans, India has seen a consistent improvement in its living standards unlike most of Africa and Indians understand the concept of generational wealth.

>t. indian

Anonymous No. 16114904

>>16114102
This and those who immigrate to the West usually have some form of wherewithal (education, money, family, etc.) bc. of their caste status (usually these people are Brahmins or Kshatryas); this is mostly the case here in America (Canada might be a different story)

Anonymous No. 16114909

>>16114056
>Is it that there’s over a billion so there’s bound to be some smart Indians
Basically, you are on average typically interacting with the top 5% of India while you're oblivious to the other 95% of India.

That's what happens when you have over a billion people of a given group and you never bother to visit them in their own country. Same issue with China, really same issue with a lot of groups.

It's why the whole "model minority" thing is complete bullshit. It's, the map is not the territory concept personified.

Anonymous No. 16114912

>>16114056
India has a population of 1.5 billion, and has virtually always been more populous than all of Europe combined; there's bound to be a few smart ones here and there, even if their average is shit. With that in mind -- that India is more a continent than a country -- compare them against Europe and they've accomplished not even 1% of that.
Indians are high achievers in America -- not so sure about England or other countries.

Anonymous No. 16114920

>>16114799
India is not an intelligent country.
The smart fraction thing probably has some merit though; the average Indian "true" IQ is probably around 85-90, but there is probably a larger amount of variance.

Anonymous No. 16114942

>>16114421
I dont think winning some battle makes anyone a genius. Who cares is the Persian empire was big, land doesnt fight. How many times must this be said?
LAND DOESNT FIGHT
Every time theres some battle someone is going to win. That doesnt make them a genius. Is Mike Tyson a genius?
Put two downie tard armies to fight each other, whoever wins is still a retard.
The same persian empire also collapsed really fast when arabian muslims attacked in in the 7th century, whom were also outnumbered likely 100 to 1. Turns out their soldiers hated their own royalty and sort of sympathized with the "underdogs", defected quickly and joined the muslims, very fast the ratio wasnt 100 to 1 anymore.
As a great man once said, you only have to kick in Persia's door and the whole rotten structure will come crashing down.

Anonymous No. 16114943

>>16114547
Harish Chandra deserves a mention
Plus they had a bunch of other people in their own ancient history, i cant be arsed to look up their names, whom did a lot of foundational scientific work

Image not available

602x416

1682034073886526.png

Anonymous No. 16114963

>>16114421
Caesar was greater than Alexander.
Alexander was a great conqueror. But Caesar was probably the greatest military mind of the ancient world, on top of being the greatest politician of his time, one of the greatest Latin writers and orators of all time. They both share in that they died too young and had much left to accomplish.

Image not available

1125x421

IMG_6231.jpg

Anonymous No. 16115292

>>16114942
>land doesn’t fight
except you tax everyone in that land (for military budget) and even pull conscripts from there.
>Put two downie tard armies to fight each other, whoever wins is still a retard.
“i do not fear an army of lions led by a sheep, i fear an army of sheep led by a lion” - alexander the great
you can’t seriously be comparing warfare to a boxing match.
>The same persian empire also collapsed really fast when arabian muslims attacked in in the 7th century, whom were also outnumbered likely 100 to 1.
persia and byzatines have been completely worn out fighting each other for decades, as well as suffering attacks from turkic peoples non stop. not to mention there were famines/diseases that destroyed them. the arabians were not outnumbered 100 to 1, don’t ever trust arab sources lol, muslim expansion was the luckiest thing ever

Anonymous No. 16115297

>>16114909
>>16114912
But why is it the ones in the west happen to be the top 5%? Doesn’t it seem most plausible that it’s because they got a western education, hence it appears indians are not low IQ, just held back

Anonymous No. 16115317

>>16115297
Obviously because legal immigration to the US acts as a filter. More often than not they're engineers, doctors, university students etc.
i.e. the same reason you can't gauge Danish IQ by just looking at Danish scientists.

Anonymous No. 16115323

>>16114737
Why not? Higher number = better posting. This is the same group of people (Chinese) who cheat in video games and see nothing wrong with the practice. Get better cheats, loser. They say.

Anonymous No. 16115337

>>16114909
I find this explanation to be deeply unsatisfying and lazy, if large population is all it took to produce geniuses and civilization, then where are the african and south east asian equivalents of Ramanujam, Bose, Confucius, Sun Tzu etc? Clearly there is something else at play here, we often mention Europe as a factory of geniuses but lets be honest here, vast majority of those geniuses came from Germanic genetic stock (I include Northern Italians here). Basically almost all geniuses Europe ever produced came from HRE + France + UK + Dutch. Dutch built a global empire despite having a population base not too dissimilar from that of Greece.

I do not deny that population size matters, but institutions seem to play a much larger role over a long term basis. It's not a co-incidence that Russia started producing geniuses only after strong contact with Germans. On the other hand, barely any notable scientists were produced in Portugal and Spain, despite both having globe spanning empires.

I guess my larger point is, IQ is very relevant over the short term, but its not set in stone, IQ of a community/nation can rise over time provided the environment is conductive.

Anonymous No. 16115350

>>16115337
Norther Italians were not of Germanic stock until recently. Them being whiter comes from recent migrations (9 million) in the 1900s to north Italy during its economic boom, as well as German mercenaries during the unification wars. The Renaissance started when Greeks (Meds) fled Constantinople during its fall and brought their knowledge with them to Italians (Meds). Also just a side note, contrary to nordicist cope, Greeks have only gotten whiter with time, and southern Italians scale closer to the ancient Romans.

Anonymous No. 16115355

>>16115350
Southern Italians are not closest to Republican Romans kek. Republican Romans are closest to modern Northern Italian, French, and Northern Spanish populations, but not identical to any of them.
Imperial "Romans" were basically Greek and Levant as they got ethnically replaced.
Northern Italians (unless you mean the literal Germans of South Tyrol) are also not of Germanic stock, though of course there is some admixture.

Anonymous No. 16115356

there's more structure within the "indian" category than there is within most other ethnicities, because of extreme caste endogamy
all noteworthy indian thinkers have been brahmins or brahmin offshoots, and tamil brahmins in particular are overrepresented

Image not available

1343x1170

1693587129588957.png

Anonymous No. 16115370

>>16115337
This is/was roughly speaking Europe's "genius-factory" core.

Image not available

730x358

IMG_6232.png

Anonymous No. 16115377

>>16115355
doesn’t change the fact they’re swarthy. only 1 member of all italian born players on the entire italian football team was born in south italy, while 2-3 were born in rome. the rest, northern italy. northern italians being white or “german” is greatly exaggerated

Anonymous No. 16115385

>>16115377
I live in Lombardia. True Northern Italians are white as French with a jew-y nose. A lot of the swarthy-looking ones are Southern Italian immigrants.

Anonymous No. 16115405

>>16115385
I wonder where Lombardia gets its name. + did northern Italy not get 9 million immigrants from northern european and slavic countries during the economic miracle?
Why must dark = greek/levantines/nafris and light = true untouched indigenous inhabitants

Anonymous No. 16115407

>>16115292
>muslim expansion was the luckiest thing ever
Yet you consider alexander to be a megagenius,. He didnt get lucky, he was just really smart.
Well, give me a practical example of his smartiness. Consider his first battle with the persians, which ought to be the hardest of all. Tell me how that went, how were the odds, the forces and how alexander pulled it with great smartiness

Anonymous No. 16115415

>>16115370
yup pretty much. there are other high iq regions that only recently produced geniuses (hungary being a very good example). ultimately institutions matter, more so than iq may i add. of course it is difficult to maintain elite institutions in a population that is uncivilized which usually (though not necessarily always) tends to be low iq people.

Anonymous No. 16115423

>>16115407
I never said he wasn’t lucky? First born to a king who just basically united all of Greece and developed the new phalanx taken from Epaminondas, and was born at the same time to be taught by Aristotle. Why do I need to explain the battle of granicus to you when you can just watch it on youtube? I guess he got lucky twenty times in a row while being outnumbered, is that what you believe?

Anonymous No. 16115431

>>16115415
institutions clearly matter since all of those people were poached by America in the 20th century
This isn't to say culture is irrelevant to innovation. But innovation by definition requires mastery of relevant preceding technologies and sciences, and often needs demand+environment+funding to exist as well. Culture can then be considered.
While those countries are quite strong in the fundamentals of science, important prerequisites for innovation, they fall short on all the other factors.

Anonymous No. 16115435

>>16115423
>I never said he wasn’t lucky?
>persians were under attack by many peoples and were tired from war, arabs were not that skilled, they won by luck
>when alexader attacked persia, the same persians existed in a state of complete peace and had no other enemies and outnumbered alexander 6 million to 1, he won so he must have been a genius

Anonymous No. 16115437

>>16115423
>Why do I need to explain the battle of granicus to you when you can just watch it on youtube?
Explain where the "genius" was in that battle

Image not available

364x900

20to1 advantahge.png

Anonymous No. 16115441

>>16115423
>I guess he got lucky twenty times in a row while being outnumbered,
Outnumbered 2 to 1, at best

Anonymous No. 16115484

>>16114125
Why didn't the monkeys just knock over the latter to get the bananas? Are they stupid?

Anonymous No. 16115505

>>16115415
Well, there's more to a people than IQ. There's differences in personality for example. Finland has an average IQ pretty much equal or higher than Sweden yet Sweden dwarfs them in "great minds".

Anonymous No. 16115519

>>16115435
>>16115441
there were barely any problems prior to alexander’s invasion of the achaemenid lol, just a couple of revolts that were put down. and alexander could’ve been outnumbered 3 to 1 in certain battles such as gaugamela, whereas muslims weren’t even outnumbered 2 to 1 and had more soldiers in some battles

Anonymous No. 16115541

>>16115437
they were positioned behind a river against a defense force, so alexander who’d typically meet the same side cavalry instead charged diagonally through the river to the persian center, and personally held them off so the phalanx could get through the river. it was a hard position and as you said the first battle against the persians so of course it was the most difficult, yet it worked and he won

Image not available

1200x1804

IMG_0766.jpg

Anonymous No. 16115607

>>16114125
if the monkeys could talk, they would all know about the water

liberal IQ, everyone

Image not available

1000x743

1066922 (1).png

Anonymous No. 16115744

>>16115337
>then where are the african and south east asian equivalents of Ramanujam, Bose, Confucius, Sun Tzu etc?
Africa and South East Asia are not countries. They are continents and islands with hundreds of distinct ethnic groups of which none have a monolithic country/ethnicity over a billion like India.

Nigeria and Indonesia are basically your largest groups and neither have reach 300 million yet. But you are starting to see them academia and science more frequently. For reference when Ramanujam was born in 1887 India's population was roughly the 250 million mark. So it actually tracks fairly decently.

Anonymous No. 16115791

>>16114599
they don't

Anonymous No. 16115876

>>16115791
So who’s been lying?

Anonymous No. 16117127

>>16115519
>whereas muslims weren’t even outnumbered 2 to 1 and had more soldiers in some battles
muslims were outnumbered 100 to 1. They had tiny tribes that could barely survive in Arabia, while persiand had lush farms.
Their basic tactic was doing hit and ru n attacks, because persians could not follow them into the desert

Image not available

468x720

StatPadder 5.webm

Anonymous No. 16117386

>>16117127
stop trusting sources from islamic HADITHS lol, watch the webm

Anonymous No. 16117400

I think its mostly their atrocious diets that is at least 1/100th actual feces.

Anonymous No. 16117754

>>16114056
The Indian Scholar lives in squalor.
Give him weights. Give him guns. Give him hot girls with bigass buns. Poor guy could really use it.

Anonymous No. 16117837

>>16114056
Indians draw their motivation purely from caste conflicts, and can only do what they do when they find a familiar society to mooch off of.
Shove the majority of them into bombay, cut off from western financial systems and forced to compete within BRICS system, and see how well these types succeed.

Anonymous No. 16117843

>>16114056
They had ONE meme tier mathematician (who hated proofs btw).

I'll believe they're "high achievers" when they actually produce someone who solves an important problem.

Image not available

950x917

orangutan hominid....jpg

Anonymous No. 16117875

>>16114125
this doesn't make the monkeys dumb. At some point a tradition is put into place to solve a particular problem. Because the problem is now solved, the future generations that carry on this tradition may not necessarily understand what problem their tradition is solving, but that doesn't mean it isn't doing what it's meant to.
In this case, it is a fact that going up the ladder results in a water spray. Just because the new monkeys dont know that doesn't make it less true. Now, are they "dumb" for not questioning it, or smart for trusting that their society which has survived millenia of natural selection probably does things for a reason, and for a good reason at that

Image not available

266x671

Screen Shot 2024-....png

Anonymous No. 16117889

>>16117843

Image not available

1024x1024

ai art greco-budd....jpg

Anonymous No. 16117892

>>16114102
>Indians are high achievers in the west because our culture doesn't reward creativity and innovation anymore
I'm inclined to agree, but also it is cope. Creativity and innovation are not rewarded with FAME as they would have been in the past, but now it is only the foremost practitioners of cutting-edge fields that make the big-bucks at FAANG companies. It's those that understand machine learning, deep-learning, high level language models, and data science at the most elite levels that take up these jobs, and surprise surprise, like every other compsci/math/engineering job, it's mostly Indians, Chinese, Koreans, Japanese, and Germans

Image not available

624x434

priest pepe.png

Anonymous No. 16117900

>>16114904
>>16117837
The caste thing is a meme. The upper-castes in India are treated the exact same way whites/asians are treated in the west. They are smacked down by affirmative action in favor of the "backward castes" (or in the west, blacks and hispanics). Yet, students from the higher castes overrepresent in the top institutions regardless. And by the way, this isn't because the higher castes have more access to wealth, because the historically wealthiest caste is the Vaisyas, who are the 3rd caste

Anonymous No. 16117914

>>16114942
> Every time theres some battle someone is going to win. That doesnt make them a genius. Is Mike Tyson a genius?

Yes, insofar as skill is considered. Mike Tyson was an absolute phenom and his rise to prominence was incredible. You are confusing the act of winning one battle with winning many, and winning them well. Tyson flew to the top like a speeding bullet, he was the youngest champion in history, and still is. Alexander was undeniably gifted when it came to warfare. No one ever said land needs to fight, but we remember the men who fought for land, and we remember most the men who took it easily. Alexander. Napoleon. Attila.

Anonymous No. 16117917

>>16117892
Do you have any data?

Anonymous No. 16118141

>>16114056
Asians have a culture built around knowledge. Plus if you're dirt poor that is a decent driver for a good work ethic

Anonymous No. 16118385

>>16115744
>none have a monolithic country/ethnicity over a billion like India

India became a country only recently, besides most significant indian figures prior to british india existed back when India was divided into multiple kingdoms and population of the subcontinent as a whole wasn't greater than 150 million. Moreover almost all indian geniuses come from the upper castes (rather than being spread out over the population) which further justifies the claim that simply having a large population is not a guarantee of geniuses. This is what essentially makes India 'unique', its the only poor country with a sizeable smart fraction which is why India can maintain some very complex projects and designs (space travel, nuclear power, nuclear submarine etc.) despite being very poor.

Anonymous No. 16118686

>>16115744
If large population and monolithic ethnicity is so important, how do you explain Europe during the middle ages/renaissance? Modern countries divided into many states, each with their own agendas and language/dialect. Even ancient Greece, famously was divided into city states that were all trying to kill each other, yet was simultaneously producing geniuses from all over

Anonymous No. 16118697

>>16118686
Good point, you require most or at least a sizeable potion of your population to be high iq, but that alone isn't enough. You would also require them to be empathetic and creative, have a philosophical thought that pushes them to uncover answers than simply assume they know everything there is to know and to that you need to add a tinge of warrior culture in moderation (too much and you would end up fighting constant tribal wars like mongols). Europeans seemed to have the best combination of these traits from middle ages onwards.

Anonymous No. 16118715

>>16118686
Europe is literally a monolith, Europeans are of same race.

Image not available

1125x324

IMG_6261.jpg

Anonymous No. 16118719

>>16117892
>>16117917
Employees by FAANG company;
Meta: 51% White, 16% Asian
Apple: 55% White, 11% Asian
Netflix: 61% White, 9% Asian
Google: 50% White, 18% Asian
Data from Zippia, which “estimates demographics and statistics for Credible by using a database of 30 million profiles. Our estimates are verified against BLS, Census, and current job openings data for accuracy.”

Anonymous No. 16118721

>>16117892
The best of Indians aren't as creative or intelligent as best of Europeans.
Over all Europeans are way better than Over all India (which isn't one nation or a society), some Indians from certain regions ethnicities etc are good at certain things.
There are communities are in India that are S tier merchants.
https://qz.com/india/459422/how-indian-families-took-over-the-antwerp-diamond-trade-from-orthodox-jewsnts.

Anonymous No. 16118821

>>16117837
>cut off from western financial systems
no one can thirive if you get suddenly cut from global trade. Its different if you have lived all your life without global trade, because you can then develop a local economy, but to just get cutoff kills you, economically.
It doesnt even have to do with western finance. This same scenario happened in the middle ages and the bronze age collapse and the soviet international trade system.

Anonymous No. 16118881

>>16115876
Chinese, of course.