🧵 Untitled Thread
Anonymous at Sat, 4 Feb 2023 17:28:14 UTC No. 134764
Why is this board so obsessed with judo while most MMA fighters don't care about this art and use folkstyle or freestyle wrestling takedowns?
Anonymous at Sat, 4 Feb 2023 18:55:21 UTC No. 134772
>>134764
A tomboy wearing a gi is far more erection-inducing than a tomboy wearing a wrestling atire. You can't possibly deny this without outing yourself as a raging homosexual.
Therefore, Judo > Wrestling
Anonymous at Sat, 4 Feb 2023 19:10:13 UTC No. 134774
>>134764
Judo is more traditional also /fit/ is the hard on board for MMA.
Anonymous at Sat, 4 Feb 2023 19:10:52 UTC No. 134775
Most of us are not wrestling age anymore while judo takes adult novices.
Anonymous at Sat, 4 Feb 2023 19:54:08 UTC No. 134780
>>134764
>while most MMA fighters don't care about this art and use folkstyle or freestyle wrestling takedowns?
It's not that MMA fighers don't care about judo. It's just that wrestling has a direct pipeline to MMA while judo doesn't.
If you're a good competitive wrestler but not good enough to make it to the Olympics or World's, your career options are limited to either transitioning to MMA or being a grade school coach. That's why prime ex-college wrestlers are a dime-a-dozen in MMA.
If you're a good competitive judoka (in most countries other than the US), you can make a living off of judo as you get a salary from your NGB. Judo also has non-compete clauses so you can't compete in MMA while you do judo. By the time people retire from judo, they're either too old, too injured, or both to transition to MMA.
Anonymous at Sat, 4 Feb 2023 22:19:24 UTC No. 134792
>>134764
90% of people who do bjj dont know what judo is, and it's literally the same martial art with a different ruleset. So if people who are super close to the sport don't even know about it and many dont believeit even works. Now, mostly American MMA fighters who barely know much history about bjj and do wrestling in school up to college are gonna tend to use their wrestling more than anything else. Almost all samboist train judo becuase they are so similar, in fact, the most influencial of sambo people took 99% of the art from japan, one coach studied japanese jiu jitsu and made a book titled "Manual of self-defense without a weapon in Jiu-Jitsu System" and the other studied at the kodokan and was one of the first foreigners to earn their black belt in judo.
Anonymous at Sat, 4 Feb 2023 23:36:25 UTC No. 134799
>>134764
MMA ruleset favors wrestling and bjj and kickboxing ovef somenthing effective like thai, boxinf or judo.
>the wrestler decide who goes to the gro
>grt it with the 12 o 6 elbow
>ACK
Anonymous at Sun, 5 Feb 2023 14:38:06 UTC No. 134852
>>134764
MMA fighters use MMA.
Anonymous at Sun, 5 Feb 2023 14:46:48 UTC No. 134854
>>134780
>Judo also has non-compete clauses so you can't compete in MMA while you do judo
it's like the people in charge of managing the sport want it to shrivel and die
Anonymous at Sun, 5 Feb 2023 18:21:58 UTC No. 134878
>>134799
Most striking these days is mutated boxing
Anonymous at Sun, 5 Feb 2023 18:36:17 UTC No. 134882
Judo is the last weeb martial art. Shame its about as useful as wet ham in a normal fight.
Anonymous at Mon, 6 Feb 2023 00:03:18 UTC No. 134918
>>134772
Why a supposed active and competitive women would feel interested in a 4chan incel?
This kills all the tomboy autism
Anonymous at Thu, 9 Feb 2023 01:31:09 UTC No. 135261
>>134775
This is the biggest reason. I'd check out catch if it was available even within a once a week driving distance, but Judo is what's here.
Anonymous at Thu, 9 Feb 2023 01:54:33 UTC No. 135262
>>134854
Unfortunately that seems to be the case. The commission tries very hard to ban each and every single move that slightly resembles wrestling, which also makes the moveset less suitable for MMA because most of the remaining techniques are most effective against an opponent wearing a gi. Judo has become more distinct and safe as a result, but it's really neutered the sport to be all about spectacle and not combat effectiveness. Judo's list of forbidden moves grows almost every year and it's quite sizeable now. I wish proper old school jiu jitsu (not BJJ) was available everywhere so we could have a more MMA oriented version of Judo that includes striking, kicking, grappling and locks. Judo definitely improved the grappling aspect of Jiu Jitsu, but everything else has been lost. Such a shame.
Anonymous at Thu, 9 Feb 2023 03:22:30 UTC No. 135268
>>134854
It’s all boomers at the top and like all boomers they only care about short term gains and don’t think anything through
>Our best athletes want to go into MMA?
>NOOOOOO THEN THEY MIGHT NOT SOEND ALL THEIR TIME GUNNING FOR THE OLYMPICS
>WHO CARES IF LONG TERM IT WILL GROW THE SPORT AND INCREASE ITS POPULARITY, TELL THAT FAGGOT HES NOT ALLOWED TO LEAVE
Anonymous at Thu, 9 Feb 2023 03:26:24 UTC No. 135269
>>134882
>Dropping people onto concrete is useless in a fight
Ok.
https://youtu.be/pfO1pOgf4Gk
Anonymous at Thu, 9 Feb 2023 03:31:26 UTC No. 135270
>>135262
> The commission tries very hard to ban each and every single move that slightly resembles wrestling,
>people still believe this stupid shit
That’s not why leg grabs were banned or any of the subsequent techniques for that matter. Leg grabs were banned because diving for the legs was used to stall time after scoring a point. Instead banning stalling the retards at the IJF just banned all leg grab techniques. On the flip side this has caused some evolution in how some techniques like kata guruma can be done, but that’s not a really good trade off. I digress though, what other moves do you think are banned for resembling wrestling? There’s shit like the Korean seoi nage that was banned but that doesn’t look anything like wrestling and the reasoning was supposedly to prevent injury. Also a dumb and gay call but it has nothing to do with wrestling.
Anonymous at Thu, 9 Feb 2023 19:04:26 UTC No. 135332
>>135269
Nigger tier shit
Anonymous at Thu, 9 Feb 2023 19:13:54 UTC No. 135334
>>135262
Bjj is unneutered judo, they are the same martil art, the only thing different about the two is the way the rulesets went and the way most gyms train. Also what you said about wrestling is not true at all >>135270
sums it up rather well. People would just keep going for fireman carrys and double legs and kept failing and stalling so the sport was losing viewers, thus losing money because it was looking boring. Judo has to appeal to more than just people who do judo, that is why bjj may never be a sport, watching people roll is one of the most boring things ever, it may be fun to do but when I'm sitting out a round and watching other people, even if I am learning from watching it is so lame how slow and uninteresting it looks most of the time
Anonymous at Thu, 9 Feb 2023 21:53:56 UTC No. 135352
Dude, judo has always been respected because it's been pressure-tested. There's a reason why all those military combative systems have judo in them like Defendu or Krav Maga.
I don't even train in Judo (did US folkstyle in high school and currently a blue belt in BJJ), but only a fucking moron would underrate or downplay Judo. No Judo means no Sombo or BJJ. Way before Judo became an Olympic and World Championship sport, judoka pressure-tested themselves against other styles across the globe. And they did very well to prove its effectiveness that non-Japanese people like the Russians, Brazilians, British, Americans, Israelis, etc. incorporated its techniques and methodology in self-defense and military arts.
Folkstyle and Freestyle wrestling takedowns are indeed very useful since they don't require clothing to grip, but Judo trips and foot sweeps are nothing to scoff at. Grappling styles shouldn't be in a pissing contest like Traditional Martial Art autists do. We're no-bullshit practitioners that know that know that regardless of what style we learn, they all boil down to using leverage and scrambling for transition. Grappling is a continuum not a be-all end-all. We incorporate from one another to improve body posturing during matches and training.
Anonymous at Thu, 9 Feb 2023 22:52:23 UTC No. 135365
>>134764
>why is this board obsessed with judo
because its cool to plant heads and i see potential in it being the basis of a unified clothed grappling system when added with BJJ (which really is the same thing). right now modern judo is cucked by its restrictive ijf ruleset that doesnt allow groundwork or leg grabs.
Why should people focus on a clothed system? because the everyday person you meet is going to at least wear a tshirt, and contrary to popular belief you can grab tshirts and fuck people up with it. who cares if you rip a shirt if you succeed in the takedown and is ripping an armbar. thats like saying that gi BJJ is useless because cloths grips are going to rip after you hit your sweeps and subs.
>MMA uses freestyle takedowns
theres a couple of reasons why modern judo isnt that popular in MMA.
The biggest is that MMA fighters dont come in wearing clothes or gi to grab on to, which completely changes the entire fighting game. Theres a reason why nearly all competitive MA have people compete in boxers and no shirt. the grappling game is changed even more: double and single leg takedowns are much harder when you have something to grab when sprawling. add this with the fact that ijf rules bans leg grabs and alot of ground submissions and modern judo is almost useless in the cage.
second biggest reason is simply that american culture has a much larger wrestling scene, and MMA is american, so more fighters do wrestling by simple statistics.
finally, the ijf cucks everyone once again by not allowing top level judokas to cross compete. the only good judokas that compete in MMA and make it to the top are russians and slavs, who practice judo but are really sambo practitioners first and foremost.
Anonymous at Thu, 9 Feb 2023 23:02:52 UTC No. 135368
>>135334
i do agree that bjj is unneutered judo in that its rules are WAYYY less restrictive, but i dislike BJJ in that it doesn't reward takedowns as much as judo. I like the ippon system that recognizes that if you throw a mfer hard onto the ground with full control, thats a fight ender. because of that theres no takedown specialists in the top tiers of bjj, that can win just from their takedowns, while there are tons of bottom position and submission specialists in bjj. now takedowns are still good in bjj because it puts you in a good dominant position, but thr fact that it cant lead to an immediate win is a massive downside to me, and i think bjj as whole suffers because they neglect developing high level takedowns.
the perfect grappling ruleset imo is one where theres the ippon or fall system of wrestling/judo mixed with the freedom of BJJ if a fight ever gets to the ground.
Anonymous at Thu, 9 Feb 2023 23:19:19 UTC No. 135371
>>135368
>if you throw a mfer hard onto the ground with full control, thats a fight ender
No it's not; I've seen so many street fight videos where the fight continues after the uke gets slammed.
>because of that theres no takedown specialists in the top tiers of bjj
I think one of the reasons why you don't see a focus on takedowns is because positions are lost and gained more readily in BJJ, and wrestling is fucking exhausting. You don't want to gas yourself out if you're just going to get swept once you get to mount.
>that can win just from their takedowns
Yeah 'cause you still have to submit people. Submitting a tough and skilled dude is hard.
>there are tons of bottom position and submission specialists in bjj
Specializing in the bottom is quite literally gay. Submissions can come from any position though. One thing you always hear in BJJ is "position over submission." I've always gone to aggressive BJJ schools that teach grappling into a superior position.
>but thr fact that it cant lead to an immediate win is a massive downside to me
Not the point of the sport. You're describing wrestling or Judo, not submission grappling.
>bjj as whole suffers because they neglect developing high level takedowns
Definitely agree. Takedowns are sick and pulling guard is for fags. You'd probably see a lot less guard-pulling is slams were allowed.
Anonymous at Thu, 9 Feb 2023 23:47:12 UTC No. 135373
>>135371
The reason why BJJ places so much emphasis on fighting off your back is because it is the WORST place to be. By neutralizing the attacker's options in the guard (this is why BJJ groundwork is fundamentally different from Judo newaza because it addresses striking from the guy on top), you have an advantage in securing a submission or reverse position to be on top yourself or scramble away.
Anonymous at Thu, 9 Feb 2023 23:50:43 UTC No. 135374
>>135365
>i see potential in it being the basis of a unified clothed grappling system when added with BJJ (which really is the same thing).
Judo is absolutely huge here (France) and I don't understand that the federation cannot see the potential of that
They could even become the basis of unified no gi grappling eventually simply by branching off of the gi one like most BJJ gyms also have no gi classes
I understand their will to make it an olympic sport easy to watch for casuals (even I don't want to watch a full grappling event) but that doesn't stop you from making a sport version and an overall grappling version
Judo is suffering from the olympisation
Anonymous at Thu, 9 Feb 2023 23:59:11 UTC No. 135377
>>135374
The IJF has been seriously considering a newaza-only tournament in the past years from what I heard. And they fostered strong ties with FIAS, the governing body of Sombo so they're not exactly in the dark about BJJ's wildfire spread over its popularity with groundfighting and submissions.
Thing is, the IJF takes itself very seriously for the World Championships and Olympics. BJJ for a LONG time was seen as a thug art in Brazil. Ever hear about the pit boys? These are entitled BJJ guys in Brazil that pick fights at clubs and bars (they always have their posse to jump in) to show off their macho attitude. The IJF doesn't want that kind of negative association and FIAS doesn't have that historical baggage either.
So they probably want to distance themselves somewhat from BJJ and MMA (which also has a negative image as human cockfighting and other bullshit spewed by journalists and politicians in the past). I would love to see Judo that has pre-WW2 techniques like leg locks and more time on the ground. There's even stuff that most referees can't even recognize as legal like Kusabi Dome (Wedge Stop) to neutralize a throw attempt.
Anonymous at Fri, 10 Feb 2023 00:05:07 UTC No. 135378
>>135377
that's good news but >newaza-only tournament also sounds too restrictive
there's probably a good balance of rewarding throws and groundwork to be found, maybe even try to have to point number to reach to weed out the borefests
>they probably want to distance themselves somewhat from BJJ and MMA
We never got confirmation but here in France MMA was illegal for a very long time (until last year or something) and rumours were that it was because the Judo federation was trying to stall for its legalization
they have no problems with BJJ though, they took it as part of their national federation
Anonymous at Fri, 10 Feb 2023 00:14:22 UTC No. 135380
>>135378
I would like to see Kosen rules become worldwide. FIAS allows 2 forms of competition: Sport which is what people usually associate it with (grappling with no chokes, but armlocks and leglocks) and Combat which is MMA-esque with strikes and grappling with protective gear.
So there's 2 types of competition that IJF can promote: The current rules for World Championship/Olympic tournaments (though they should bring back leg attacks somehow) and the Kosen rules that Shichitei has from the following:
13. A player may only win the match by scoring Ippon.
14. A score of Ippon shall be awarded for the following:
- Nagewaza (throw) landing the opponent squarely on the back (basic interpretation identical to Kodokan)
- Osaekomi (pin) for 30 seconds
- Ude Kansetsuwaza (elbow lock) forcing the opponent to tap out or causing a referee stoppage to prevent injury
- Shimewaza (choke) forcing the opponent to tap or rendering the opponent unconscious
15. A score of Wazari shall be awarded where:
- The player cleanly throws the opponent, but not squarely onto the back
- Osaekomi is held for 25-29 seconds
16. The Head Judge shall award Ippon to a player who scores a second Wazari.
(Wazari x 2 = Ippon). This means that a player with Wazari only needs to pin for 25 seconds to win the match.
17. If competition time runs out and no player has scored Ippon, the match is a draw—even where one player scored Wazari.
Anonymous at Fri, 10 Feb 2023 02:37:03 UTC No. 135420
>>135371
> No it's not; I've seen so many street fight videos where the fight continues after the uke gets slammed.
And there’s a shitload, more I’d wager, if the opposite being the case. In the cases where it doesn’t imediately end the fight there’s a shitload more where the opponent is so badly damaged he has almost no ability to continue, try as he may
Anonymous at Fri, 10 Feb 2023 05:03:12 UTC No. 135445
>>135371
>slams arent always fight enders
i dont dispute that submissions are the ultimate, safe, fight enders, but that doesnt change the fact that when thrown into the cold hard ground with someone landing on too of you, you will likely break bones and get a concussion, and i want a competition that respects that.
>specializing in bottom is gay
i agree, bottom position and guard being considered positionally neutral is wrong. guard is vulnerable to ground n pound, and its so much harder to get out of bottom mount and bottom side ctrl, than to escape someones guard. i think we can get rid of pure guard and bottom players if refs force a general standup when one person disengages from the ground back to their feet and dont want to try guard passing. no more butt scooting. I also think that sacrifice throws like tomoe nage, sumi gaeshi, should be penalized for purposefully putting your back into the ground, while still maintaining the ability to score the takedown or submission. that way you can penalize guard pulls and sacrifice throws if you do it poorly, but still maintain the ability to win if youre good enough at sacrifice throws or submitting from guard.
>not the point of the sport
i just want a grappling system that values both takedowns and ground position/submission. Judo is fucking impossible to change because of the iron grip of the IJF, but i think BJJ with its more grassroots theme can actually pull it off by making a new competition ruleset of BJJ
Anonymous at Fri, 10 Feb 2023 06:29:11 UTC No. 135451
>>135445
>i just want a grappling system that values both takedowns and ground position/submission.
I was about to say "well I think ADCC has more takedowns," when I looked it up on youtube, clicked on a Gordon Ryan match, and the first thing he did was sit on his ass.
>i think we can get rid of pure guard and bottom players if refs force a general standup when one person disengages from the ground back to their feet and dont want to try guard passing. no more butt scooting.
I think that's a great idea. Would love to see some competitions implement this. This is so much more fun as a ruleset, and all it takes is one simple change.
Anonymous at Fri, 10 Feb 2023 17:04:35 UTC No. 135482
>>134918
This is the board for active and competitive men. Quit projecting and go touch mat.
Anonymous at Fri, 10 Feb 2023 18:15:06 UTC No. 135492
>>134764
Because judo is the only takedown-focused grappling sport available for adult novices.
>>134854
That's not even true. The reason it's dead in the US has nothing to do with the rules. The amount of people doing judo worldwide has increased.
It can simultaneously be bad for the sport, but also not holding back the sport in popularity. But what America wants for the sport is completely irrelevant. It's a judo backwater that can't regularly produce international competitors, and can't maintain a large degree of grassroots popularity.
Anonymous at Fri, 10 Feb 2023 18:17:01 UTC No. 135493
>>134775
I think you also see a crossover of experienced BJJ guys that started with BJJ and later want to seriously learn takedowns.
Anonymous at Fri, 10 Feb 2023 18:42:42 UTC No. 135498
>>135445
>I also think that sacrifice throws like tomoe nage, sumi gaeshi, should be penalized for purposefully putting your back into the ground, while still maintaining the ability to score the takedown or submission. that way you can penalize guard pulls and sacrifice throws if you do it poorly
I really like the Sambo scoring system in this respect. If you can get past "no chokes", I think it's one of the best grappling rulesets - fun to participate in, and not piss-boring to watch.
Anonymous at Fri, 10 Feb 2023 19:32:56 UTC No. 135504
Literally no point to do anything but MMA unless you're in it for the money or something.
Anonymous at Fri, 10 Feb 2023 21:15:45 UTC No. 135512
>>135504
But there's not much money in MMA either. You'd make more as a can in boxing.
Anonymous at Fri, 10 Feb 2023 23:43:04 UTC No. 135531
>>135492
>can't maintain a large degree of grassroots popularity
What do you think are the reasons for this?
Anonymous at Sat, 11 Feb 2023 04:18:54 UTC No. 135549
>>135531
A lot of clubs being run as part-time hobbies. Your typical BJJ gym is open every night. And a race to the bottom in prices means that a lot of gyms can't afford to be nice and appealing.
It's no coincidence that the regional judo scenes that have success - CA, TX, NE Corridor, FL - have gym owners that run their clubs as a full time job and charge prices closer to BJJ or MMA clubs.
On the grassroots side, a lot of American judo clubs would benefit from merging into a local BJJ gym (because if there's any market for judo, there are multiple BJJ places) and doing judo classes 2-3x a week at a BJJ club.
Anonymous at Sat, 11 Feb 2023 05:15:40 UTC No. 135552
>>134764
Most MMA fighters aren't weeb incels
Most 4channers OTOH are
Anonymous at Sat, 11 Feb 2023 05:45:11 UTC No. 135555
>>135552
>Most MMA fighters aren't weeb incels
You might be surprised. Fighters are the virgins of the athletic world.
Anonymous at Sat, 11 Feb 2023 05:59:25 UTC No. 135556
>>135504
>no point in doing the things you like unless you make money from it
I don’t do judo because I care about da streetz. I’m not 19 anymore. I do it because I really genuinely enjoy the sport of throwing people.
Anonymous at Sat, 11 Feb 2023 07:22:25 UTC No. 135559
>>135549
>And a race to the bottom in prices means that a lot of gyms can't afford to be nice and appealing.
God I wish. I pay $220 a month for Jiu Jitsu. Ralph Gracie's in Berkeley. Great gym though.
Anonymous at Mon, 20 Feb 2023 21:54:20 UTC No. 136584
>>134764
because judo looks cool and wrestling looks gay even though wrestling is super effective and judo is only situationally effective
Anonymous at Wed, 22 Feb 2023 15:51:08 UTC No. 136770
>>134764
It's not obsessed, there's like 1-3 guys that go into every thread talking shit about every art and telling everyone Judo is the best, meanwhile they don't actually post in the /judo/ thread since it never gets bumped at the same time all the hate threads and BJJ general get bumped.
Anonymous at Wed, 22 Feb 2023 17:29:34 UTC No. 136779
>>135270
The leg ban is usually cited as trying to make it more distinct from wrestling so it can stay in the olympics (it has trips unlike Greco, but unlike freestyle now you can't grab the legs).
But really the bans seem to happen whenever there's a shift in the meta. They came down hard on certain grips common in the Caucuses (from chidaoba and sambo etc) because they made the judo look less traditional and that's what they hate most of all.
They want the judo to always look as traditional as possible and any development that threatens that gets banned or restricted.
Anonymous at Wed, 22 Feb 2023 18:06:13 UTC No. 136783
>>136779
I really hate the ijf. I really hope whatever new generation replaces them is less retarded.
Anonymous at Wed, 22 Feb 2023 20:40:38 UTC No. 136812
>>136779
Making it look different from wrestling wasnt the goal, people kept getting stuffed on half assed shots and bad kata gurumas and it was boring and ugly to watch. This was becoming a major thing, the mongolians were the main problem with them doing a majority of the kata gurumas. This notion that they hate what isn't traditional isn't true at all, the organizers want to make a profit and the ratings were going down since judo was becoming more bland since people would stall more and spam the same thing over and over. It would be the equivalent of today if 70% of people competing only did drop seoi nage over and over with no variation. It would get very boring to watch. Also where did you get this information on certain grips being restricted because it doesn't look traditional? There have been throws from every imaginable grip since judo was founded, the only reason you can't hold onto a non-traditional grip for longer than 5 seconds is to prevent you from just holding it and doing nothing since as soon as an opponent is out gripped they are going to play defensively. In today's ruleset you can throw from anywhere as long as you have gripped the gi and don't tough the legs unless it is the last action of a throw. I don't agree with many of the rules but there is a reason for them, most of them are made so that the average person will be entertained when they are watching it, as there are many people who dont participate in judo who watch it.
Anonymous at Thu, 23 Feb 2023 00:07:23 UTC No. 136825
>>136812
>people competing only did drop seoi nage over and over with no variation
I feel attacked, did you watch my Judo comp last weekend?
Anonymous at Thu, 23 Feb 2023 00:50:15 UTC No. 136828
>>136825
Are you a mid-level color belt? If so that kind of thing is expected?
Anonymous at Thu, 23 Feb 2023 04:31:27 UTC No. 136838
>>136828
I am, [spoiler]but I'm also 145kg[/spoiler]
Anonymous at Thu, 23 Feb 2023 06:05:39 UTC No. 136846
>>134852
You have to be 18 years or older to use this site.
Anonymous at Thu, 23 Feb 2023 16:23:53 UTC No. 136872
>>136825
Lol it's a great move dont let me discourage you king, but I am not going to watch your matches if that's all I'm going to see
Anonymous at Thu, 23 Feb 2023 21:03:26 UTC No. 136890
>>134764
Gotta have some variety and try new things anon, expand your horizons and always empty your cup grasshopper.
Anonymous at Sun, 26 Feb 2023 09:33:00 UTC No. 137153
>>134775
Not to mention most of the world does Judo, and is far more accessible than say Freestyle or Greco. Judo is Greco in pyjamas, so close enough.
Anonymous at Sun, 26 Feb 2023 09:35:34 UTC No. 137154
>>135332
No more than Muay Thai or wrasslin' practitioners starting fights. There are shitty people in every fighting art.
Anonymous at Sun, 26 Feb 2023 15:59:15 UTC No. 137184
>>137154
Ive personally found that BJJ and boxing tend to have the worst egos/bullies
BJJ also has some of the nicest and most helpful ppl too tho
yeah theres a few assholes in every martial art
Anonymous at Sun, 26 Feb 2023 16:11:12 UTC No. 137185
>>134775
I'd love to train wrestling, but as far as I can tell all the wrestling clubs are just for people who did the sport in high school or college. Is it even possible to learn to wrestle as an adult? Obviously most MMA gyms teach a little, but I mean just wrestling.
Anonymous at Sun, 26 Feb 2023 16:33:31 UTC No. 137188
>>137184
There are bullies in the games of chess and Rubik’s cube competitions.
The entire world is dogshit, just live with it.
Anonymous at Mon, 27 Feb 2023 14:46:38 UTC No. 137336
>>137153
It's jacket Greco with matwork that allows chokes, armlocks and pins
>>137184
I really hate that 1 asshole that HAS to go for hard shots during sparring and I have to liver shot him to stop
Anonymous at Mon, 27 Feb 2023 14:47:39 UTC No. 137337
>>137185
Some submission grappling gyms will teach wrestling
Anonymous at Tue, 28 Feb 2023 04:08:43 UTC No. 137435
>>137185
>wrestling clubs are just for people who did the sport in high school or college
If there's a wrestling club around you like that and you show up with good work ethic and a willingness to learn they'll probably be glad to have you as a drill dummy capable of learning and becoming a proper practice partner.
Anonymous at Tue, 28 Feb 2023 07:45:31 UTC No. 137448
>>137185
You never wrestled at home? I sometimes wonder this about people. wrestling is the easiest thing to learn on your own. well not totally on your own, but with a partner of course.The rules of freestyle are no submissions which means that you are relatively safe to partake in the sport without any supervision. You are free to attempt any sort of maneuver on someone without worrying about getting punched or choked out. otoh no submissions makes wrestling a vicious sport. People will cause each other pain any way they can. titty twisters, rug burns, twisting a knee, wedgy with your own scrotum, thumb up the ass, stuffing a takedown so hard you concuss the dude, not wearing deoderant, being a fat ass, and of course the good old crossface.
but, mma is obviously has submissions and no pins, so even though judo is unlike mma in that there's a gi, it's rules are more akin to mma
Anonymous at Tue, 28 Feb 2023 15:01:27 UTC No. 137468
>>137448
You rolling around on the front lawn with your brother is not “learning wrestling” you stupid faggot.
Anonymous at Tue, 28 Feb 2023 18:51:10 UTC No. 137494
>>137448
>titty twisters, twisting a knee, wedgy with your own scrotum, thumb up the ass
None of these are allowed in wrestling and "twisting a knee" is literally a BJJ submission.
Anonymous at Sun, 5 Mar 2023 00:04:27 UTC No. 137985
>>135365
>who practice judo but are really sambo practitioners first and foremost.
What's the main difference between Judo and Sambo?
Anonymous at Sun, 5 Mar 2023 01:01:29 UTC No. 137990
>>135504
I just want to get good at something.
Anonymous at Sun, 5 Mar 2023 02:05:52 UTC No. 137992
Judo irl ( on concrete) is lethal in street fights
Chain rasslin works with a cage
Anonymous at Sun, 5 Mar 2023 03:23:08 UTC No. 138001
>>137985
Sambo has more wrestling pick-ups and grips not usually found in judo though the Japanese adapted when dealing with it. Sambo has leglocks which judo banned from competition. It also has a Combat competition where guys wear protective gear and can do MMA.
Anonymous at Fri, 24 Mar 2023 21:02:22 UTC No. 140078
>>137468
then how did people create wrestling? surely it was from people"rolling around on the front lawn" thousands of years ago
Anonymous at Sat, 25 Mar 2023 01:22:53 UTC No. 140101
>>140078
>bros I can totally figure out thousands of years worth of passed down experience by myself, in my lifetime, with no instruction
Sure buddy, you should reinvent the wheel while you’re at it too
Anonymous at Sat, 25 Mar 2023 07:24:24 UTC No. 140127
>>134764
because people who actually know judo know that its throws are much better than shitty wrestling takedowns, more realistic and powerful.
most MMA fighters use wrestling takedowns because mastering judo takes years and years
Anonymous at Sat, 25 Mar 2023 10:06:08 UTC No. 140136
>>135451
No it's not its a garbage ruleset. That basically destroys open guard and returns people to the most boring part of a bjj match, where people just walk in circles for 10 minutes getting and losing collar ties. The stand up wrestling is easily the worst part of BJJ.
Anonymous at Sat, 25 Mar 2023 14:48:35 UTC No. 140147
>>140127
I’ve done judo for ten years. I’ve cross trained in many arts including catch and there’s nothing unrealistic or weak about their takedowns. Seriously leave this board.
Anonymous at Sat, 25 Mar 2023 16:00:18 UTC No. 140153
>>140127
>because people who actually know judo know that its throws are much better than shitty wrestling takedowns
Kano incorporated American wrestling's fireman's carry (kata guruma) into his system because none of his weeb throws were working against a big guy who kept dunking on him for being a manlet. Kata guruma is to this day recognized as the most powerful throw in judo and has been removed from competition to stop people from spamming kata guruma and ignoring the other throws. Whether you want the best of judo or the best of wrestling you want kata guruma.
Anonymous at Sat, 25 Mar 2023 16:28:25 UTC No. 140157
>>140101
You didnt answer the question, how did people create wrestling? Or are you getting defensive because you are realizing you can learn to wrestle through trial and error
Anonymous at Sat, 25 Mar 2023 16:32:08 UTC No. 140158
>>140138
>>140139
Sometimes I wish judo just stayed a secret in japan, most of the retards today dont deserve the takedowns or the armbar, triangle choke, kneebar and all the other techniques.
Anonymous at Sat, 25 Mar 2023 18:29:19 UTC No. 140174
>>140157
It was developed over generations. If you honestly unironically think you’re going to “learn wrestling” doing backyard wwe with your hick friends you’re too retarded to have a serious conversation with. I invite you to go test your “skills” in an open grappling competition.
Anonymous at Sat, 25 Mar 2023 18:33:45 UTC No. 140175
>>140158
Why?
Anonymous at Sat, 25 Mar 2023 21:55:41 UTC No. 140191
>>140174
so what you said is true, the first generation would never have anything to pass on if you cant learn wreslting through trial and error. Do you think that just grabbing a leg or two really requires thousands of years to figure out? Maybe for your bloodline but it's a rather simple concept. Obviously going to a coach who learned it formally is going to be more refined and clean but the human body can only move so many ways, the fact that you can't grasp this concept is embarrassing.
Anonymous at Sat, 25 Mar 2023 22:04:40 UTC No. 140194
>>140191
He's saying that while you've gained a surface animal-level familiarity with the concept of grappling another untrained human that you've not actually "learned" wrestling, especially in the /xs/ context of wrestling as it exists today. A child who can draw pictures to tell you a story may have figured out a primitive way to communicate on paper but he hasn't learned how to write.
Anonymous at Tue, 28 Mar 2023 08:17:43 UTC No. 140469
>>140158
All those techniques were already in Catch, in fact Kano probably stole some from the westerners.
Anonymous at Tue, 28 Mar 2023 08:18:46 UTC No. 140470
>>140174
It worked for Bas Rutten (somewhat).
Anonymous at Tue, 28 Mar 2023 14:49:13 UTC No. 140499
>>140494
I might be talking out of my ass, but I remember hearing that Bas didn't really train grappling until after he lost to Funaki, but then he went to specifically train with grapplers to learn (I want to say with Funaki but I might be wrong).
Anonymous at Tue, 28 Mar 2023 21:28:32 UTC No. 140524
>>140499
He mentions his grappling training in his personal commentaries on his fights, it's available on YouTube somewhere. He apparently had to figure out a lot of it in the ring because his fight schedule was so packed in his early days. He didn't get to seriously train grappling until a while in. You can see in his early fights that he only really knows how to guillotine and gets taken down at will. Bas had an usual ability to land kill shots as he was being taken down though, which is what saved him. His biggest defeats were always against good grapplers. Unless you've got Bas striking power I wouldn't recommend emulating him.