Anonymous at Mon, 1 May 2023 11:27:02 UTC No. 144409

>>144399
cause they're from the bullshitdo times when martial arts didn't mix and the "masters" had that chinese mentality that "I am too good to even test at you or else I'll kill you cause I am too good" it followed the same ideology of Aikido fora while, just like karate

I have practiced taekwondo for 13 years and desu all the "martial" part of it is shit

The old taekwondo fighting style is very very very effective tho

Anonymous at Mon, 1 May 2023 22:15:04 UTC No. 144452

>>144399
Karate punches are supposed to be the best, only below boxing punches

Anonymous at Mon, 1 May 2023 23:13:20 UTC No. 144460

>>144452
Sure, karate guys would totally outbox dutch kickboxers

Anonymous at Mon, 1 May 2023 23:19:57 UTC No. 144462

>>144460
Karate punches are different

Anonymous at Tue, 2 May 2023 01:29:57 UTC No. 144468

Completely misunderstanding the training goal of Ikken Hissatsu helps

Anonymous at Tue, 2 May 2023 13:35:05 UTC No. 144512

>>144409
>the bullshitdo times when martial arts didn't mix

this is a fairly new idea (that was only popularized by shotokan karate), most of the old masters actually cross-trained so often that a lot of styles became styles just because the students codified the style, i mean just look up any of the old chinese masters, even the tai chi knew more than one.
and as a fellow TKD guy (and i think we have the same time practicing, lol) i agree old korean stuff is awesome, its a shame that very few masters still teach it (like the ldh guy in another thread)

>Why are arm techniques in taekwondo and karate so retarded?
it has to do with the practice of the styles, some are for conditioning, others were practiced by grabbing or tripping someone first, and some others are reinterpretations that were gathered by books/oral tradition, and because of the idiotic tendency of TMA teachers of not questioning "THE TEACHINGS™" , it turned them retarded, still just learn boxing + a TMA, and you are set

Anonymous at Tue, 2 May 2023 15:04:18 UTC No. 144522

>>144460
>dutch
Who? The referee?

Anonymous at Mon, 15 May 2023 11:13:18 UTC No. 146424

>>144399
They were modified in the 1930s to "look good" for demostrations for WW2 japanese mentality (like military marching but with imaginary opponent kicks and punches) by most masters (especially Gigo Funakoshi) to instill them into japanese culture. Taekwondo took that and put them in another package (names, diferent movements, etc..) to instill them in Korea.
Arm techniques by older masters ( mostly purely okinawan karate) or newer masters that didn't adhere to that standard (Oyama or any of his offshoots)are pretty good though

Anonymous at Mon, 15 May 2023 12:36:38 UTC No. 146430

>>144468
Ikken Hissatsu is some modern bullshit nonsense borrowed from sword fighting

Anonymous at Mon, 15 May 2023 14:46:04 UTC No. 146443

There's 2 or 3 main events that shaped the karate we know today
But the most important one in post ww2 they taught the foreign GIs stationed in Japan wrong as a joke and they came back with nonsense that became the new standard

Anonymous at Mon, 15 May 2023 21:41:37 UTC No. 146472

>>146424
>Oyama
Miyagi you mean
All roads lead back to goju

Kyokushin is just watered down goju

Anonymous at Mon, 15 May 2023 23:12:53 UTC No. 146482

>>146472
What about Uechi-Ryu?

Anonymous at Tue, 16 May 2023 00:43:06 UTC No. 146489

>>146443
>in post ww2 they taught the foreign GIs stationed in Japan wrong as a joke
is there actually documentation of that?

Anonymous at Tue, 16 May 2023 02:27:10 UTC No. 146500

>>144399
Asians

Anonymous at Tue, 16 May 2023 02:32:12 UTC No. 146502

>>144452
If you're talking about pure power with literally 0 defense.

Anonymous at Tue, 16 May 2023 02:33:13 UTC No. 146503

>>144522
>not knowing the horsemeat fuelled Ubereme

Anonymous at Tue, 16 May 2023 11:14:54 UTC No. 146543

>>146472
Miyagi is included in the
>older masters ( mostly purely okinawan karate)
category, but there where others that are good and don't come back to Goju or even predate it.

Oyama is mentioned apart because his style is not older okinawan but modern japanese and he trained under Gigo. Probably the only japanese modern karate that is a strong fighting art.

Anonymous at Tue, 16 May 2023 11:26:30 UTC No. 146545

>>144399
Bait thread but whatever: Most of these techniques are not taught in a realistic matter anymore thanks to Funaokshis Kata fetish and him thinking sparring = babarian brawl. The Oi Zuki is used as grabbing the hand of the opponent (probably in a grappling scenario) and then punch so your opponent can turn around while he eats your punch. Gedan Barai is just same principe as a low kick but with your arm instead. Age Uke is a forward arm slam towards the opponents chin or neck. Uchi Uke is a sort of inside fist strike after you secured the hand of your opponent. Soto Uke is an outside fist strike to the temple of the head. They do work but are definitely more of situational thing compared to the usual boxing strikes. They stem from the Tegumi/Shima parts of Karate and afaik the white crane kung fu grapplig aspects.

Anonymous at Tue, 16 May 2023 12:30:53 UTC No. 146546

>>144399
>Gross generalization inspired by ignorance
>>144409
>uninformed edgelord basic assumptions
This board was made for containment purposes me thinks.

Anonymous at Tue, 16 May 2023 16:40:14 UTC No. 146574

>>146546
literally 4chan

Anonymous at Tue, 16 May 2023 19:29:48 UTC No. 146596

>>146489
Moot wont let me post the link but,

He doesn't outright make any accusations but there are dated documents provided where you can make a strong inference that yamaguchi was a bit of a charlatan that at best was a helio Gracie type character that just embellished and stretched the truth but he may be more of a Steven seagal character that just made things up all together

Anonymous at Wed, 17 May 2023 10:25:51 UTC No. 146685

>>146596
Yamaguchi doesnt seem like the most sane type either way from the info you can find about him online

Anonymous at Wed, 17 May 2023 16:44:38 UTC No. 146744

>>146482
I'm not sure young man, but jesse enkamp ranked it as A tier for karate styles that will actually teach you how to fight

Anonymous at Mon, 5 Jun 2023 09:32:34 UTC No. 149987

Great>>146574
>>144399

Anonymous at Tue, 6 Jun 2023 16:52:20 UTC No. 150186

>>146546
>the techniques aren't bad you're just le ignorant
Imagine still doing this in 2023

Anonymous at Tue, 6 Jun 2023 20:49:24 UTC No. 150212

>>144399
They're over 100 years old and haven't changed with the times. You have to consider that something as fundamental as the boxing jab didn't exist at the time karate was created as a national sport. They had the "left lead" in boxing, but it was not the quick probing jab as we know it today. It was punch with the full weight of the body behind it. In that context, those big sweeping blocks from karate make a lot more sense. They exist to parry stiffer punches with more mass behind them, because those heavy punches were the peak of fighting technique at the time. Karate clung to tradition and got left behind as more modern techniques developed. The Karateka who wanted to do things more effectively split off to start kickboxing.

picrel is an 1890s boxing book. Look at how similar it looks to karate. Karate is the peak of fighting excellence...in the early 20th century.

Anonymous at Tue, 6 Jun 2023 21:00:13 UTC No. 150215

>>150212
jabs are fake news
boxing is fake fighting with gloves and wraps and only above the belt and no grabbing

take that away and you'll see jabs disappear too because your hands aren't equipped to put out volume the way jab usage requires you to
every punch needs to be a picked shot because you don't have as many of them in your quiver

Anonymous at Tue, 6 Jun 2023 21:19:54 UTC No. 150219

>>150215
You don't seem to know what a jab is in even the most basic sense.

Anonymous at Tue, 6 Jun 2023 21:25:31 UTC No. 150220

>>150219
what I do know is people have been fighting each other for thousands of years, and if you're saying the boxing jab only appeared after queensbury rules started forcing people to fight a certain way, then its a fake technique

Anonymous at Tue, 6 Jun 2023 22:15:47 UTC No. 150228

>>150220
These guys have no rules and also use jabs
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=AKlDn4gt4yg

Anonymous at Wed, 7 Jun 2023 02:13:37 UTC No. 150274

>>150228
lmao the guy in the white shorts is so fucking greased

Anonymous at Wed, 7 Jun 2023 03:09:19 UTC No. 150281

>>144409
>The old taekwondo fighting style is very very very effective tho
Taekkyon?

Anonymous at Fri, 9 Jun 2023 21:02:27 UTC No. 150720

>>144512
>most of the old masters actually cross-trained so often that a lot of styles became styles just because the students codified the style
This. The old guy that I learned taekwondo from was also mastered in hapkido and judo, and also taught those. You could see the spots where things started to bleed together in his different classes.

Anonymous at Sat, 10 Jun 2023 13:10:10 UTC No. 150774

>>144399
Yes, go and try to train a nation in fighting and minimizing damage to near zero at the same time. Of course whatever comes out is demoralized bullshit with black belts that never even drew blood in their carreers.

Anonymous at Sun, 11 Jun 2023 16:36:49 UTC No. 150888

>>150215
lol, lmao even

Anonymous at Sat, 24 Jun 2023 05:20:43 UTC No. 152802

>>150281
>Taekkyon
A nationalist meme with no actual connection to tkd

Anonymous at Tue, 27 Jun 2023 18:21:35 UTC No. 153466

>>144399
sigh
because they're not designed for fighting.
the basis of most "traditional" martial arts is about defining itself as special/traditional/distinct from other things. form>function. coming up with cool names, cool meanings behind names, colors, etc.

arm techniques in striking and grappling sports where the primary goal is to strike/grapple against an unwilling opponent and win will serve that function. Depending on ruleset changes or equipment changes (different size/design gloves) the techniques will change as well. function>form

If you want to be a martial arts historian, sure, suck each others dicks over who can talk about the most obscure martial art. If you want to train how to fight, train in a way that makes you a better fighter. Run, lift, stretch, hit pads and the bags, spar, and grapple. It's not fuckin rocket science.

Anonymous at Wed, 28 Jun 2023 15:31:55 UTC No. 153618

>>144399
They're just primitive bare knuckle boxing techniques. They work fine.

Anonymous at Wed, 28 Jun 2023 15:32:59 UTC No. 153619

>>146482
It's the best Naha Te style imho.

t. experience with Goju and Wado

Anonymous at Wed, 28 Jun 2023 15:36:02 UTC No. 153620

>>150228
Because they only train with modern boxing as a base.
Back in bare knuckle times, you only had sluggers because power to knock the other guy out was the most important thing, you couldn't win on points. So the technique was maximizing power and dealing with full power punches. In that regard, those karate style blocks work well, and in street fights, where the other guy wants to KTFO you, they still do. In the ring, not so much.

Anonymous at Wed, 28 Jun 2023 15:45:13 UTC No. 153625

>>153620
> Back in bare knuckle times, you only had sluggers
HEMAfag here, just did a seminar on pugilism recently. Wanted to stop by to call you a retard who has no idea what he’s talking about and are just making shit up. The same basic combinations (1-2, 1-2-3, 3-4, etc.) are the same things people were doing 200 years ago.

🗑️ Anonymous at Sun, 9 Jul 2023 14:23:40 UTC No. 155443

>>144399
Ok>>144460
T>>144462
>>144468
>>144512
>>144522
>>146472
>>146482
>>146489
>>146500
>>146502
>>146503

Anonymous at Sun, 9 Jul 2023 14:57:12 UTC No. 155454

>>144399
>Doesn't understand the purpose of kata
Pretty sure thats what you're talking about. A lot of dullards don't get kata. It is a type of muscle memory programming. It looks the way it does, so pronounced with such unessarily defined forms, because OG masters understood that rehearsed movements translate differently in raw performance. A kata is the most ridiculously 'perfect' movement. That hopefully if you practice enough, in raw use, which is naturally more chaotic & sloppy, your form will shine through. Thats my own faggy interpretation of it anyways. No one in their right mind expects you to genuinely look like that in a fight. Shit, not even point matches do.
>>144409
Thats a modern McDojo thing. Back in the day sparring & mixing it up was all they ever did. Kinda why the older the version of any given style, the more violent it is. Even in your own example with Taekkyon.

Anonymous at Tue, 11 Jul 2023 01:00:51 UTC No. 155681

Was I an asshole for this or not:
When I was a teen I worked to pay for my TKD training and got all the way up to what I thought was my blackbelt test. I took a rather expensive test and received the RED/ BLACK semi black belt which was the prerequisite for the black belt test. Only, the test from this instructor was 400 dollars, on top of the semi black belt test of 150. Like I said, I paid my own way and it being expensive I couldn’t afford It so I never took it.
I went to the military and when I got back home after a few years and some people I knew were running a semi successful school and knew my goal of finally getting my certification and black belt. They told me if I taught at their school for free, they would certify me and give me the black belt. So I taught the kids class. Then it became kid class and adults. Then it was staying later to ‘help’ after the gym closed, then on weekends promote with flyers. It became strenuous and I never really got much training from them, but sure enough they gave me a black belt in a big promotion, but did not give me the signed certification with the date. I asked why and they gave me the same answer I got before, that the certification was ‘special with special ink’ and needed 300 bucks to give that to me. I was pissed. Despite wearing the belt I felt like the situation was bad, so I called them for a meeting and told them our goals weren’t being fairly met and I couldn’t continue working for them as its taking more time than I would like and due to that I didn’t feel comfortable paying for anything further- then gave them back the black belt.
I thought it was the right thing to do since It felt like the implication of me wearing it meant I was in their debt. However, After the fact, they told people I was disrespectful and by giving their black belt back was received as me saying they weren’t respectable. I don’t know if I was an asshole in that situation or what, but what do you think?

Anonymous at Tue, 11 Jul 2023 01:05:58 UTC No. 155682

>>146503
>not knowing a joke

Anonymous at Tue, 11 Jul 2023 01:13:24 UTC No. 155683

>>155681
Who cares what they think, but you should’ve kept it.

Anonymous at Tue, 11 Jul 2023 01:31:20 UTC No. 155687

>>144399
Drills like that are the same thing as forms. Not exactly trying to put forward a combat-effective technique here. If you go to a school worth their salt, they will obviously teach you more practical techniques. Nobody is getting into a horse stance and doing this shit in sparring.

>t. 17 years tkd experience, 3rd dan WTF

>>150720
This is also true in my experience. Same with Hapkido, Judo, and TKD as well even.

SAGE at Tue, 11 Jul 2023 05:45:37 UTC No. 155707

>>144409
i did TKD for 10 years. its 70% leg strikes. you dont learn TKD to punch someone, you learn it to kick their fucking head off or snap their spine with force-redistribution, and look cool doing it.
you dont even bother blocking most of the time, just dodge and jump back on one foot while jabbing at their face with LIGHTNING FAST snap kicks
the only problem is when you get knocked down or fuck up one of the 8-part techniques and hear your knee snap in half because you forgot to lift your heel.
one my black belt board breaks was; jump snap kick, side piercing kick (both in the same jump), then a punch on a third board before you land. its just something that you have to practice over and over again, but you learn cool shit about your body doing it.
you shouldn't learn it to fight people. if you need to use it on someone just ambush them from above with a flying side kick.
destroy your opponent with ONE technique

Anonymous at Tue, 11 Jul 2023 10:11:02 UTC No. 155723

>>155681
You were not an asshole.
You only need to pay for the test and certification if is from a reputable federation at the stablished fee and no more.
I was only charged by my old teacher for the new belt after he deemed prepared for the next level of training. Never paid him for an examination.
The only test you have to pay was when getting the black belt, because he did not award it, but you had to book a date for an exam at a federation hall and then you were tested by a group of masters and given a valid certificate and belt.
And even still he didn't value it much, even though he had very high formal ranking, and usually our class stayed in low grades for a much longer time than other schools
Our blue and brown belts were usually better prepared than most junior black belts in other schools.
From what you said I think if you find a good teacher he would give you a black belt and certificate in little time.
You already did more than most to earn it. You were conned into doing chores and weekend work when none of that is required for a certificate.

Anonymous at Tue, 11 Jul 2023 15:39:43 UTC No. 155748

>>155681
NTA. Sounds like some real mcdojo shit. Belt tests shouldn’t be that expensive, even if you need to get official certification.

Anonymous at Wed, 12 Jul 2023 07:58:34 UTC No. 155812

>>144460
"Karate" is a new word. The old word is "Chinese hand" meaning Chinese martial arts. Every unarmed technique is based on weapon techniques, hence no need to train two sets of techniques. The straight punch is the same motion with sai or knife. Blocks are the same with the sai, shield or armor. If you read the Bubishi, it depicts a ton of weapons and is literally a military manual. Martial arts are no sport.
https://youtu.be/FXKGA7xJR04
Only retards do boxing or MMA. They are the only sport where the objective is to hurt the other athlete. Why not go all the way then and use weapons? Best stab wound wins.

Anonymous at Wed, 12 Jul 2023 11:48:45 UTC No. 155848

>>150720
Pittsburgh?

Anonymous at Wed, 12 Jul 2023 14:08:41 UTC No. 155859

>>155681
I thank God everyday that I never fell down the rabbit hole of mcdojo traditional martial arts. Imagine actually paying money for a “belt test”.

Anonymous at Fri, 14 Jul 2023 11:23:52 UTC No. 156176

>>155681
Bro sorry to say this but you probably only trained in mcdojos. Look for some full contact stuff or atleast schools that are linked to an organisation that is from the respective martial arts birthplace/country. Also read up/watch some vids and articles on how to spot mcdojos jesus

Anonymous at Fri, 14 Jul 2023 11:28:49 UTC No. 156177

>>155812
No sparring cope. Good sparring should never be neglected (even if you are not a fan of it, something i can absolutley understand) and cross training should be done sometimes unless your area is full of gyms with gangsters or something. Boxing and MMA have their merit in exposing all the bullshit that often floats around in tma.

Anonymous at Fri, 14 Jul 2023 17:44:31 UTC No. 156252

>>155812
>Only retards do boxing or MMA. They are the only sport where the objective is to hurt the other athlete
That is what fighting is, yes. If you’re not practicing to potentially injure someone you’re not fighting. If you’re not fighting you’re not doing martial arts. Therefore, you don’t do martial arts.

Anonymous at Sat, 15 Jul 2023 15:34:07 UTC No. 156437

At some point people forgot what range they were practicing for mostly

Anonymous at Sat, 15 Jul 2023 15:42:00 UTC No. 156440

>>155859
Thats standard. No matter what style. Even BJJ gyms charge for tests.

Anonymous at Sun, 16 Jul 2023 09:28:08 UTC No. 156724

>>150215
>I have never fought a real fight in competition or out in my life: the post

Anonymous at Mon, 17 Jul 2023 11:49:29 UTC No. 156946

>>146472
>Kyokushin is just watered down goju
Yeah, but what about downsides?

Anonymous at Mon, 17 Jul 2023 14:41:55 UTC No. 156965

>>156440
My judo dojo doesn’t. Get fucked lol, belt tests are gay and pointless. My place just gives you a belt when they think you’re ready for it

Anonymous at Mon, 17 Jul 2023 19:53:02 UTC No. 157013

>>156965
Judo gyms in the USA are non profit.

Anonymous at Mon, 17 Jul 2023 20:03:07 UTC No. 157016

>>157013
And that’s a problem?

Anonymous at Mon, 17 Jul 2023 20:24:42 UTC No. 157025

>>157016
It's not entirely good for Judo in some regards, but it just means that it's not an apples to apples comparison. Most Judo instructors have a day job.

Anonymous at Mon, 17 Jul 2023 20:25:59 UTC No. 157026

>>157025
Either way, I’m going to lmao forever at anyone who’s ever paid for a belt test

Anonymous at Sun, 23 Jul 2023 19:50:41 UTC No. 157819

>>157026
Based