🧵 Untitled Thread
Anonymous at Sat, 29 Jul 2023 20:01:04 UTC No. 159032
Are Judo strikes more similar to Karate striking or Boxing striking in terms of power output?
Anonymous at Sat, 29 Jul 2023 20:34:07 UTC No. 159036
>D
why does that strike go against basic human anatomy?
Anonymous at Sat, 29 Jul 2023 20:38:54 UTC No. 159037
>>159036
It's not if you're part Vulcan.
Anonymous at Sat, 29 Jul 2023 20:45:11 UTC No. 159040
>>159032
If we assume that karate and boxing provide the same power, that is, work by time, and we also assume that karate has more force but are executed less frequently than boxing then yeah, I would lean to say karate is more similar.
Truth is, strikes in judo are just more kuzushi, they play second fiddle to the throws.
Anonymous at Sat, 29 Jul 2023 20:57:43 UTC No. 159041
>>159040
>karate has more force
They don't, boxing has more force because boxers use more rotational power and weight.
Anonymous at Sat, 29 Jul 2023 21:28:16 UTC No. 159046
Anonymous at Sat, 29 Jul 2023 21:39:36 UTC No. 159048
>>159046
Wooob woobwoobwoob
Nyaah nyaah
Anonymous at Sat, 29 Jul 2023 22:05:27 UTC No. 159053
>>159046
I know. but due to tendon placement is extremely hard to maintain and compress with any strength.
if it was a claw-like movement its possible to do but keeping an extension with that kind of finger placement is impossible to execute quickly
Anonymous at Sat, 29 Jul 2023 22:11:00 UTC No. 159054
>>159041
Then the opposite is true in my first statement. Regardless what I said at the end is what I think it's ultimately true. It's just and odd comparision.
I think historically it's more likely than judo strikes are based off karate, but that's a point aside. Karate and boxing strike to open up the chance for another,more devastating strike. For judo it's just more kuzushi. I think OP is just asking yet the same old question of what to crosstrain as a judoka.
Anonymous at Sat, 29 Jul 2023 22:16:52 UTC No. 159055
>>159053
An eye jab doesn't have to be all that hard to be effective. I've seen people break boards and do pushups with F so I'd imagine D is more than adequate for an eye jab. Do you have a better eye jab?
Anonymous at Sat, 29 Jul 2023 22:20:58 UTC No. 159056
>>159032
Judo strikes are mean to be the most bare-bonded basic form most for distraction and then a takedown than actual usage
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 14:52:56 UTC No. 160637
so sad we lost this to the ijf
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 14:57:19 UTC No. 160639
>>160637
lol, judo never had good striking you’re not missing out on anything. Don’t believe me? Observe:
https://youtu.be/P7arqpKao0g
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 15:28:57 UTC No. 160644
>>160639
thats kata
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 15:34:17 UTC No. 160645
>>160639
I could be wrong, but wasn't judo striking pretty much "smack him in the face so he's easier to throw"? And then, "stomp on him after you throw him so you don't have to get down there and submit him". So it's not as if it needed to be the most fancy scientific striking of all time.
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 15:44:45 UTC No. 160647
>>160644
No shit retard. That’s how striking was practiced in judo, through kata. I highlighted this one specifically because it’s the only solo kata and it demonstrates strikes.
>>160645
Basically yea, but no one cares to do kata nowadays unless you’re testing for a black belt or are a kata competition weirdo. This isn’t to say that it doesn’t “work” but it’s not like IJF took away some fantastic striking system. Do you really need instruction on how to karate chop a guy in the nose after throwing him down (this is in the katas for real btw)?.
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 15:54:51 UTC No. 160652
>>160647
holy retard batman
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 16:02:20 UTC No. 160654
>>160652
I’m sorry I broke your delusion that judo’s atemi-waza was a good striking system
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 16:05:52 UTC No. 160655
>>160654
im sorry you're so fucking retarded, like jesus christ dude that was just embarrassing to read
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 16:10:53 UTC No. 160658
>>160655
What part of it is wrong?
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 16:17:06 UTC No. 160660
>>160658
>Basically yea, but no one cares to do kata nowadays unless you’re testing for a black belt or are a kata competition weirdo. This isn’t to say that it doesn’t “work” but it’s not like IJF took away some fantastic striking system. Do you really need instruction on how to karate chop a guy in the nose after throwing him down (this is in the katas for real btw)?.
atemi-waza was a fantastic striking system for judo, kata is important regardless of what belt or what your goal is, but most of all how in the hell can you say
>Do you really need instruction on how to karate chop a guy in the nose after throwing him down.
lmao thats like telling someone trying to do muay thai that they dont need instructions for how to sweep someone's leg after they try and teep, i can't even fathom how retarded someone could be to say something this apathetic
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 16:29:19 UTC No. 160664
>>160660
>atemi-waza was a fantastic striking system for judo
lol
> kata is important regardless of what belt or what your goal is
LOL we don’t do kata that much anymore because modern sport science and practices produces superior athletes. If kata was really making people fantastic judoka all the top guys I. The Olympics would be doing it every day. They don’t because it’s not important, it’s just tradition.
Also, what is “it’s a great striking system for judo” even supposed to mean? I’ll remind you that when masohiko Kimura was faced against a western boxer he resolved to learn that style of fighting in addition to his judo because he realized atemi waza was shit. I can dig up a source on that if you really want to.
> lmao thats like telling someone trying to do muay thai that they dont need instructions for how to sweep someone's leg after they try and teep
It’s not like that at all you dumbass because unlike judoka the way Muay Thai fighters use their strikes is against live fighting opponents. I’m sorry you need someone to hold your hand and walk you through punching a guy who’s already on the floor and not moving.
>inb4 well what if he is moving
Then you ought not to be doing judo to learn that kind of striking since that’s not what you learn through kata.
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 16:52:10 UTC No. 160669
>>160664
>Also, what is “it’s a great striking system for judo” even supposed to mean
>because he realized atemi waza was shit
>man uses strikes instead of using strikes when needing to strike against striker, this makes one set of strikes ineffective instead of another set of strikes despite them being the same
mother of god how do you not walk around sticking your finger in electrical sockets? do you have a caretaker? please do your nancy drew work and find a source, go on
>It’s not like that at all you dumbass because unlike judoka the way Muay Thai fighters use their strikes is against live fighting opponents
its exactly the same thing you stooge
>Muay Thai fighters use their strikes is against live fighting opponents
>judo doesnt use live fighting and all atemi waza is excluded from everything except kata
oh my god this is just getting bananas now, can you even draw a picture of a clock if someone asked you to?
>Then you ought not to be doing judo to learn that kind of striking since that’s not what you learn through kata.
and i lol'd i just lol'd so hard today
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 17:03:17 UTC No. 160672
>>160664
>I’ll remind you that when masohiko Kimura was faced against a western boxer he resolved to learn that style of fighting in addition to his judo because he realized atemi waza was shit. I can dig up a source on that if you really want to.
If you know a good source I'd like to read about that.
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 17:04:53 UTC No. 160673
>>160664
>he realized atemi waza was shit
did he take the microphone at the end of the fight and heartfully declare that atemi waza a lie and all of judo was built around lies and that you should become a boxer instead?
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 17:09:23 UTC No. 160674
>>160673
Even if he did, the judo autist would "no true Scotsman" him
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 17:20:43 UTC No. 160676
>>160672
>https://judoinfo.com/kimura4/
>In those days, there was a black boxer named T. He was a big man weighing about 100kg, and has won a pro title. He was the best boxer in the US Marine Corps. “I am no match to you in judo, but in boxing, you will never beat me.” He boasted. One day I practiced boxing with him. Since I was trained in Karate, I thought “Even though I cannot kick as in karate, it is similar to karate. So, I would be OK.” But the result was miserable. I took blows after blows. In a few minutes, my head started to “ring”, and got knocked down. I also took a lot of body blows, and I was completely groggy. It was not even to be called a match since I closed my eyes even when his glove lightly passed in front of my eyes. This boxing practice was like a fight between an adult and a child. I covered my aching head and body, and thought, “If I did not know this type of fighting in addition to judo, I would not be able to defend myself from a danger.” After this I asked him to give me boxing instruction twice a week. But the boxing “instruction” was a rough one in which I got only beaten up in a one-sided manner. One day, the state of taking so many blows really got to my nerves that I blocked his right punch with my left arm, lifted him up for Ippon-seoi and tried to slam him onto the mat. He then said “No Judo, no, no!” with a pathetic tone of voice. So, I took him down safely to the floor. This practice lasted for 1 year. Thanks to my effort, I became able to go 40-60 with him. Of course, I was the 40.
I’ll point out rereading this that judos atemi waza was such a non-factor in his fighting that he didn’t even mention it in addition to karate, lol
>>160673
He literally said that if he didn’t become well rounded in striking in addition to judo he feared he would not be able to protect himself
>>160669
I’ve literally never seen someone so autistically dedicated to defending judo’s atemi waza of all things lol.
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 17:28:24 UTC No. 160678
>>160676
The highest-ranked judoka I've ever met was also a very highly ranked taekwondo practitioner and thought the two complimented each other well. All judo students learned some striking and all taekwondo students learned some grappling.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kyu_H
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 17:30:28 UTC No. 160680
>>160678
I agree with the sentiment, \\\+/// ought to be revived on this board.
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 18:03:15 UTC No. 160688
>>160676
>literally gets so tired of nigger boxing that he snaps and does judo on him
>I’ll point out rereading this that judos atemi waza was such a non-factor in his fighting that he didn’t even mention it in addition to karate
probably because all striking is atemi waza and atemi waza is all striking loafer brain
>He literally said that if he didn’t become well rounded in striking in addition to judo he feared he would not be able to protect himself
im calling bullshit, in a matter of fact, in a LE REAL STREET FIGHT kimura supposedly wiped up 4 military police
>The MP men did this to everyone on the line one by one including women. When someone did not stoop down, they delivered another strike. My turn was approaching. While I was wondering about what to do, my turn came. One of the MP men extended his arm trying to grab my lapel. I struck his hand with full force. Their facial expression changed suddenly. The four MP men surrounded me and took me to the middle of Nagaroku Bridge nearby the station. This was not an ordinary fight to me. I had to win this fight to defend the honor of judo. One of them suddenly threw a right straight at my face. I blocked the punch with my left arm, and kicked him in the groin with full force. He crumbled on the spot. When I turned back my head, another huge MP extended his arms and attacked me trying to grab me from behind. I then hit his right arm hard with knife hand, and then threw him into the river by Seoi-nage. The other two were watching this scene in amazement, but charged at me one by one. I delivered a head butt into the face of the third man. He was knocked out. I disposed of the last man by squeezing his balls with full force. Ever since I was in junior high, I have been called Master Groin Squeezer, and had absolute confidence in this technique.
that's coming from this article https://judoinfo.com/kimura4/ (paraphrased)
so lol, looks like full range of striking that was built on the foundation of atemi waza
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 18:09:34 UTC No. 160689
>>160688
> probably because all striking is atemi waza and atemi waza is all striking loafer brain
>judo atemi waza good when I count literally everything as atemi waza
Ok buddy
>Long MP story
I like that story a lot. But it doesn’t really change the fact that judos striking system is not a good one. Plenty of people have won street fights using mcdojo crap because the opponents don’t usually have a clue what they’re doing, that doesn’t make it a “great” system. I’ll quote again,
>If I did not know this type of fighting in addition to judo, I would not be able to defend myself from a danger
Clearly judo legend masohiko kimura doesn’t have a clue what he’s talking about though. Atemi waza in judo is the greatest thing ever developed and all you’ll ever need.
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 18:14:16 UTC No. 160691
>>160689
>Atemi waza in judo is the greatest thing ever developed and all you’ll ever need.
based and truthpilled
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 18:17:33 UTC No. 160692
>>160688
>I disposed of the last man by squeezing his balls with full force. Ever since I was in junior high, I have been called Master Groin Squeezer, and had absolute confidence in this technique.
I wish the IJF would let us do this.
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 18:17:52 UTC No. 160693
>>160691
I know you’re probably the same resident autist that obsessively posts about judo beats everything on this board, and I want to believe you’re a troll, but you’re so dedicated to this weird bit I honestly can’t tell.
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 18:21:21 UTC No. 160696
>>160689
>But it doesn’t really change the fact that judos striking system is not a good one
do you actually know what 2+2 equals? serious question if you have the mental capabilities to do any sort of connections
>Clearly judo legend masohiko kimura doesn’t have a clue what he’s talking about though
well clearly it didn't matter since he defeated 4 military police officers without the prior knowledge of boxing. he did do karate which is identical to atemi waza in strikes. so masahiko was, by today's standards, a kudo practitioner.
atemi waza still stands superior, it's the twin uncle of all the striking arts whether you realize it or not
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 18:24:45 UTC No. 160697
>>160693
judo literally does beat everything in real life altercations because judo is so greatly ranged and practical. its the product of jiu-jitsu which is the greatest 'self-defensive' martial art in the world but judo came along and was pretty much the redux version of it
i dont give a fuck if it cant win in a boxing ring with boxing rules or a wrestling match with wrestling rules, if it can get you out of a situation the best it IS the best and i dont care thats my logic and whatever exists without my knowledge exists without my consent
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 18:31:20 UTC No. 160698
>>160696
You should enter modern mma as a true judo purist. No striking training only atemi waza learned from kata
>>160697
What is your rank in judo?
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 18:41:18 UTC No. 160701
>>160700
I’m a judoka though
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 18:45:27 UTC No. 160702
>>160698
I stopped taking gi judo 5 years back, i had just got my brown belt. found no-gi and fell in love with that so now i do exclusively no-gi.
>>160700
damn straight
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 18:46:21 UTC No. 160703
>>160702
So you’re obsessed with judo and think it’s the best thing ever but don’t even compete and train the sport properly?
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 18:51:12 UTC No. 160704
>>160703
sport judo is fucking gay and is one of the reasons i stopped taking gi judo, judo is the greatest thing ever.
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 18:53:54 UTC No. 160706
>>160704
>sport judo is fucking gay and is one of the reasons i stopped taking gi judo
You know everywhere else in the world that isn’t your brain we call “gi judo” and “ sport judo” just judo. It was made to be a sport. Kano himself writes about this. The dichotomy of in one hand saying
>judo is fucking gay
And
>judo is the greatest thing ever
Is pretty fucking funny though. I’m convinced your a schizoposter now.
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 18:56:59 UTC No. 160707
>>160706
i don't give a fuck, i can do what ever. i know judo
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 18:59:17 UTC No. 160710
>>160707
Where do you compete in nogi judo?
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 19:02:36 UTC No. 160712
>>160710
we don't compete
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 19:11:57 UTC No. 160715
>>160712
Or train
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 19:12:37 UTC No. 160716
>>160712
lol, lmao even
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 19:15:34 UTC No. 160718
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 19:27:54 UTC No. 160721
>>160720
i dont need your amphetamines that help motivate you to draw in the lines
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 19:45:06 UTC No. 160725
>>160706
>It was made to be a sport. Kano himself writes about this.
Does he? I specifically remember Dr. Kano writing about the shortcomings of sports and gymnastics and how judo was different. I haven't read all of his stuff yet so if you've got more information I'd like to read it.
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 19:46:14 UTC No. 160726
>>160706
>It was made to be a sport
LOL
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 19:51:36 UTC No. 160727
>>160725
I’ll paraphrase since I don’t have my book right in front of me. For context, older styles of jujutsu were seen as an activity only useful to ruffians and thugs because Japan was no longer at war and the samurai were gone. Kano, being deeply interested in physical education, saw a shortcoming in most sports in that they developed the body in an unequal fashion. Gymnastics he believed would develop the body more properly, but saw that it was uninteresting to children and young men. Judo, Kano believed, as a sporting martial art would allow for the full development of the body and mind while at the same time being useful and interesting. Judo was therefore distilled in such a way that it could practiced relatively safely under sporting rules. This was the goal, to create a sport that also developed the entire body and promoted good values for children and young men.
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 19:52:37 UTC No. 160728
>>160726
Kano himself lobbied to get Judo added to the Olympics as an international sport. I don’t know how you could argue that wasn’t a goal.
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 19:56:20 UTC No. 160729
>>160728
Money, money, money.
Ain't it funny,
In a rich man's world.
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 20:00:45 UTC No. 160730
>>160729
?????
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 20:21:26 UTC No. 160731
>>160688
>I disposed of the last man by squeezing his balls with full force. Ever since I was in junior high, I have been called Master Groin Squeezer, and had absolute confidence in this technique
God Kimura was so fucking cool
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 21:04:08 UTC No. 160740
>>160731
There’s a story in there also where he was challenged by the best jukendo (essentially kendo but with bayonets) practioner to a match since he was the best judoka. He doesn’t know what to do so he takes his time getting to the line. When he does he decides, as soon as hajime is called he javelin throws his bayonet at the other guys face which he bats away, while distracted by the weapon kimura charges him, clinches and tosses him to the floor.
Anonymous at Tue, 8 Aug 2023 22:35:42 UTC No. 160748
>>160740
Just watched a video about that incident!
https://youtu.be/DIDoCHZ5b3w
Anonymous at Wed, 9 Aug 2023 01:22:05 UTC No. 160767
>>160748
I’ll give you another then about the Gracie’s being shitbags. Before his fight with helio but after he had accepted their challenge, they tried to spread rumors in a local newspaper that kimura was actually a columbian and not actually a Japanese judoka and therefore unworthy to fight them. They literally tried to get out of the fight by race swapping him lol, which he then said forced him to rush to the embassy to get documentation of his citizenship to rebuke them.
Anonymous at Wed, 9 Aug 2023 01:29:49 UTC No. 160769
>>160767
>which he then said forced him to rush to the embassy to get documentation of his citizenship to rebuke them.
holy lol
Anonymous at Wed, 9 Aug 2023 02:03:11 UTC No. 160772
>>160728
Bullshit.
>I have been asked by people of various sections as to the wisdom and possibility of Judo being introduced with other games and sports at the Olympic Games. My view on the matter, at present, is rather passive. If it be the desire of other member countries, I have no objection. But '''I do not feel inclined to take any initiative. For one thing, Judo in reality is not a mere sport or game. I regard it as a principle of life, art and science. In fact, it is a means for personal cultural attainment.'
Anonymous at Wed, 9 Aug 2023 02:13:14 UTC No. 160773
>>160772
I Oopsied on that one, I didn’t realize his work for the Olympic committee was unrelated to judo entering in the Olympics.
Anonymous at Wed, 9 Aug 2023 10:34:33 UTC No. 160808
>>159055
Yeah, don't do an eye jab
Anonymous at Sat, 2 Sep 2023 20:22:09 UTC No. 164839
Ok
Anonymous at Mon, 11 Sep 2023 03:25:01 UTC No. 166116
>>159046
When you aim for the upper bridge of the nose with a spearhand strike, your fingers will slide into an eye socket regardless.
Anonymous at Mon, 11 Sep 2023 11:56:07 UTC No. 166152
>>159053
That's why: https://youtu.be/DWzWwx8T3nE?t=89 practice was done traditionally.
Nippon Nukite is also such a movement where they only separate the the index finger for more accurate striking.
Also, you can always train those tendons in other ways as well, pick up a pencil extend your curled up fingers, extensor training as well with rubber bands and other things is also possible and grippers.
People miss out the whole point of conditioning.
Anonymous at Mon, 11 Sep 2023 11:57:09 UTC No. 166153
>>166152
Nihon nukite* sorry about that.
Anonymous at Mon, 11 Sep 2023 13:04:09 UTC No. 166161
>>160808
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LeN
Some classic tricks.
Anonymous at Mon, 11 Sep 2023 13:05:47 UTC No. 166162
>>166161
They removed this part of it, dammit: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yFq